Vokey same grinds for Sand and Lob?

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By Diggey

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  1. Doug E

    Doug E
    Urbana, MD

    Presently, I have an SM8 54.12D and a SM8 58.12D. I used to have a 54.10S and a 58.12D in my SM7s. Chipping or pitching with a 54, I have found more more versatility with the D grind than the S. I have always liked the 58D for pitching and chipping too. Haven't noticed any difference in full and 3/4 square-faced shots between the old S grind and the new D grind.

    I am planning to purchase an alternate SM8 60.08M lob wedge for more options around the green, on days when the course conditions favor such. I can flop just fine with the 58.12D from all sorts of lies and conditions, but when the rough is sparse or nearly bare in spots in winter, and I need to mini-flop from two feet off the green to a tight, downhill pin, a little more speed through the ball is easier to control and execute with a high lofted, lower bounce wedge, IMO. So, depending on the conditions of the day, I will platoon my 58D and my 60M. 90-95% of the time, though, the 58.12D would work fine for me in all likleihood.
  2. Mike M

    Mike M
    Marblehead MA

    I have a 54.10S and a 58.08M. I've had the 58.08 M for a while. It's really versatile; I can hit it square, open it, shut it down, hit bunker shots etc.The 54 has just been added to the bag. I wanted a different grind than the M, and to be honest I had a hard time choosing between the D and the S grind.
  3. Lou G

    Lou G
    San Diego, CA

    Mike M said:

    I have a 54.10S and a 58.08M. I've had the 58.08 M for a while. It's really versatile; I can hit it square, open it, shut it down, hit bunker shots etc.The 54 has just been added to the bag. I wanted a different grind than the M, and to be honest I had a hard time choosing between the D and the S grind.

    Same here. My basic setup has been 46-10F (44*) - 50-08F - 58-08M (57*) and Callie PM Grind 64/10. I just added 54-10S back (switched to 58-12K in 2017) and it was good for pitching and chippling but not really spectacular out of bunkers. The 58-08M gets the height I need for deeper bunkers. 58-08M and 58-14K are equal in most things but where the M wins out is flop shots and it glides better out of thick grass.
  4. Tosh.

    Tosh.
    Dundee,Scotland.

    The whole grind thing just confuses me.........
  5. Anthony C

    Anthony C
    Tinton Falls NJ

    I recently took the online wedge fit on vokey.com. I entered my swing type, conditions, and shots I use my wedges for and it came up with the D grind for both a 56 and 60. I know its just an online tool, but I have a fitting soon to further fit my game.

    I love the idea of the S, but I think I'd like to try 56 D and 60 K. I love the idea of the 60 K being the ultimate green side bunker club. Let's just say I hit a lot of sand.

    I currently play the M grind and I like it as well.
  6. Marc W

    Marc W
    las vegas, NV

    I was recently fit for S grind in sand and lob but I’ve read that vokey prefers to fit people in higher bounce sand and lower bounce lob, not sure why that would be. I was between d and s grinds so maybe I’ll get a d for one
  7. Mike M

    Mike M
    Marblehead MA

    Marc, just a guess, but I think the reasoning for a lower bounce lob is because it might be easier to manipulate the club face open and closed with a lower bounce wedge vs a higher bounce wedge, especially on chips and pitches close to the green. In terms of the sand wedge, the last thing you want to do is leave it in the bunker. More bounce will help you get through a bunker shot a little easier than less bounce, in most sand conditions.

    Just a thought...
  8. BMaddigan

    BMaddigan

    My wedge purchases are always based on bounce and feel. I prefer low bounce on all of my wedges. As I have stated in previous posts, I am truly amazed that the average person can distinguish between the different grinds.
  9. Dale V

    Dale V
    Surprise AZ

    BMaddigan said:

    My wedge purchases are always based on bounce and feel. I prefer low bounce on all of my wedges. As I have stated in previous posts, I am truly amazed that the average person can distinguish between the different grinds.

    I will admit that I am not a great player but bounce and grind has always been very noticeable to me. I really can tell the difference when playing different grasses. All my years playing bermuda grass the high bounce wedge glided through on chips. You didn't want the leading edge to dig in. Now that i am playing bent and kikuyu grass in SoCal, the grass really grabs the bottom of the club so I have to use less bounce or add more forward lean. No matter what loft and grind we end up picking, the key is practice to build confidence.
  10. Anthony C

    Anthony C
    Tinton Falls NJ

    Well said, Dale. The average player has a lot riding on proper Bounce and Grind.
  11. BMaddigan

    BMaddigan

    Bounce, absolutely. My issue is that I don't think the average guy can distinguish between the different grinds. Pros for sure can tell, but too many guys get hung up on grind. Again, get the correct bounce to suit your game, but spend less time worrying about the grind.
  12. Anthony C

    Anthony C
    Tinton Falls NJ

    There are grinds that offer more forgiveness, therefore the average golfer should pay more attention to those.
  13. Doug E

    Doug E
    Urbana, MD

    No disrespect at all, just my differing view. IMO, grinds make a big difference particularly on SW and LW. I have three different Vokey LWs, a 58.14 K grind, a 58.12 D grind and a 60.08 M grind. Each one plays differently around the green with a slightly to fully opened face. On full-swing, square-faced shots, however, there is not much noticeable difference, though the K grind gives me the most confidence when it is very soft or muddy in the fairway. And, the K grind is awesome from soft sand in greenside bunkers. Unfortunately, I don't care for it for tight lie flops. Since I can only use one of these three LWs a day, the K grind gets very little use these days. The D grind and M grind are much more versatile for me and I play the one of those that is better for the conditions of the day/course.

    Am I the "average" guy? I don't know. I do play and practice a lot of golf---5 or 6 days a week until Covid-19 shut us down (but that's a whole 'nother thread)---so I'm very in-tune with my wedges, but I'm certainly no pro.
  14. Anthony C

    Anthony C
    Tinton Falls NJ

    Well said, Doug.
  15. Ryan L

    Ryan L
    UK

    The K grind is the most forgiving and great for soft sand in bunkers like you say. This would make you think the K is the best option for the a beginner, right? But if it lacks versatility and is difficult in a tight lie then would you say this is not a good option for a beginner? Or is this where the other wedges come in to play?
  16. Mike M

    Mike M
    Marblehead MA

    Piggybacking on Doug's comments,it's very easy to open the face of an M grind wedge, and very difficult to do so with a K grind. On the same topic, as Doug said, hitting a K grind off a tight lie can be tricky at best.The K grind is much better suited to really soft conditions while the M is good for firm conditions and tight lies.

    If you get the chance to demo either of those you'll see what I mean. If you play a firm course like a lot of us do, take both wedges find a spot with a tight lie and hit both. To test in soft conditions,find some soft sand, or some wet turf.

  17. Anthony C

    Anthony C
    Tinton Falls NJ

    Well said everyone. Grind is another great option for any skill level. There are more forgiving grinds for different conditions. I'm in the process for finding out what's best for me. I have a fitting coming up in a couple months. I play the M now, but I saw the D is a more forgiving version, so I'm intrigued.
  18. Former Member

    Former Member

    I like to have a high bounce and low bounce wedge so no matter the condition I find myself in, I'm covered. I went with 54/14 bounce and 60/4 bounce on my last 2 sets of Vokey wedges.
  19. Joe D

    Joe D
    mantua, OH

    Military
    my wedge set up for what it's worth (SM7) is a 52.08F 56.08M 60.08M. my 52 is generally a full swing club. I use my 56 and 60 for work around the green
  20. Lou G

    Lou G
    San Diego, CA

    M grind bent 2* strong is pretty versatile. I have 58-08M bent to 56. Also have 60-04L.
  21. Bax

    Bax
    Nebraska

    Lou G said:

    M grind bent 2* strong is pretty versatile. I have 58-08M bent to 56. Also have 60-04L.

    Since they didn’t make the 58L in the SM8, my fitter/teacher took a 60M grind and bent it 2 degree strong to a 58 which made it with 6 degrees of bounce. It felt great around the greens and the bunker, very versatile and loved the feel.

    Thinking of doing the same on the 56D bent to a 54 with 10 degree of bounce. More versatility with the D grind than the S and the same degree of bounce after it’s bent 2 degree strong.
  22. Jon S

    Jon S
    Collinsville, CT

    Military
    I like to have a sand wedge with something like 12* bounce and like 3-5* on the lob wedge. It gives you more versatility for different lies. Sometimes you want more bounce, and sometimes you want less bounce... it all depends on the lie.

    And especially if you want to play a shorter shot or you prefer to open the wedge up a lot, the lesser bounce will allow fo that easily. Where as with more bounce, you need a special grind at a minimum and have to concern yourself with thinning the shot.

    And lastly, I'd rather hit a shot a little heavy than hit it thin. I think results are much worse when you thin a shot, so too much bounce is risk/reward. If you're steep, it can help, but it can also burn you. IMO, work on your technique if you need a high bounce and dig too much.



  23. RS

    RS
    United Kingdom

    When I was about to purchase my SM5 wedges, I thought the ideal combo would be 50F, 54S, and 58M. But after testing the wedges on a demo day, I did not like the feel of S grind. So, I ended up having 50.08F, 54.10M, and 58.08M. All set stronger by one degree to be aligned with my stock 716mb pitching wedge, which is 47 degree. Come to think of it, I tested them on carpet. Probably, I would have gotten more insights testing them on various lies. But I read on one forum where one guy bought a few grind types and tested them all. He sold the S grind because he did not like the feel.

    Like BMaddigan, I guessed I tested the wedges based on feel and bounce. I like the feel of M grind. And, I did not choose the higher bounce because in general, the courses I play do not have fluffly thick sand bunkers.

    If I am getting this correct, the purpose of choosing grind is for versatility but I associated this with feel (maybe this is not the right way). On the other hand, the purpose of choosing the right bounce is for better turf interaction (on firm, medium, or soft turf, including the fluffy sand bunker). The softer the turf, the more bounce recommended.

    So when considering the turf type, we should look into the amount of bounce rather than the type of grind. When considering for versatility, we then look into the grind type. Correct me if I am wrong.
  24. SMunro

    SMunro
    Didcot

    I’d suggest if the s grind works for you, I.e, you lean the shaft back for height then that works for you. I use m and l grinds which can be used to cut the ball up in air. Though I do vary bounce, higher bounce on m grind for soft lies and l grind for hard packed sand in bunkers or sliding under ball on tight lies.
  25. BHutto

    BHutto

    Our course's bunkers went through an extended period of being basically hardpan due to repeated heavy rains combined with drainage systems in need of maintenance. Over the last couple months they've gradually been repaired and returned to normal, fairly soft conditions.

    It's been quite an education in matching wedge to conditions. I have a 54.12F and a 58.04L as my two choices. There is no swing that I could possibly manufacture which will let me play a hardpan-bunker shot with that 14 degree F-grind and keep the ball on the green. Likewise, in a bunker full of new fluffy sand trying to use the 4 degree L-grind just asking for trouble (unless I open the face way up and swing very hard).

    Once the new sand settles in I'll go back to having a choice depending on the specific shot. But when conditions get extreme, very high or very low bounce just isn't an option. Glad I've got two very different choices on hand.
  26. Lou G

    Lou G
    San Diego, CA

    BHutto said:

    Our course's bunkers went through an extended period of being basically hardpan due to repeated heavy rains combined with drainage systems in need of maintenance. Over the last couple months they've gradually been repaired and returned to normal, fairly soft conditions.

    It's been quite an education in matching wedge to conditions. I have a 54.12F and a 58.04L as my two choices. There is no swing that I could possibly manufacture which will let me play a hardpan-bunker shot with that 14 degree F-grind and keep the ball on the green. Likewise, in a bunker full of new fluffy sand trying to use the 4 degree L-grind just asking for trouble (unless I open the face way up and swing very hard).

    Once the new sand settles in I'll go back to having a choice depending on the specific shot. But when conditions get extreme, very high or very low bounce just isn't an option. Glad I've got two very different choices on hand.

    K grind is versatile. I played 58-14K bent to 56. Didn’t notice a lot of difference playing a low bounce K. Where D grind wins out are thick grass and open face shots. I can train myself to hit D grind on a firm lie.
  27. Jason R

    Jason R
    Ottawa, ON

    I went with M Grind on both my 56 and 62 for my recent SM8 Order. In my fitting (on course, around the greens and out of bunkers) it really seemed the most flexible for all shots.
  28. Anthony C

    Anthony C
    Tinton Falls NJ

    That M grind is awesome! The perfect grind!
  29. Jon S

    Jon S
    Collinsville, CT

    Military
    Grinds absolutely matter. It greatly changes the turf interaction and with wedge play that's very important. I recommend a wedge fitting on a Titleist Thursday to determine what works best for your swing and how you approach shots around the green.

    I personally think the best strategy with wedges is to go mid to high bounce on the sand wedge and mid to low bounce on the lob wedge. That way you have more tools for the job and can use a club based on how tight the lie is or how soft the sand is and use the bounce and grind options to your advantage.

  30. CZambito

    CZambito

    Got a question for you guys. I’m pretty new to golf and have a 46PW and 51GW both set wedges from my ZX7s. I want to grab a Vokey wedge or two. I’m thinking of either grabbing just a 56 or 56 and 60. If I went 56, would you recommend going 56M grind so it could be opened up for flop shots? Or if I went 56 and 60, should I do 56S and 60M? I know it’s all personal but just curious about people’s opinions between the M grind or S grind and if I have the right idea. Appreciate any help. Thanks.
  31. Lou G

    Lou G
    San Diego, CA

    CZambito said:

    Got a question for you guys. I’m pretty new to golf and have a 46PW and 51GW both set wedges from my ZX7s. I want to grab a Vokey wedge or two. I’m thinking of either grabbing just a 56 or 56 and 60. If I went 56, would you recommend going 56M grind so it could be opened up for flop shots? Or if I went 56 and 60, should I do 56S and 60M? I know it’s all personal but just curious about people’s opinions between the M grind or S grind and if I have the right idea. Appreciate any help. Thanks.

    I’d personally do 56-08M and 60-04T. Not a particular fan of S grind; great for chipping and pitching but awful in bunkers. I use 54-12D bent to 53, 58-04T and 64W for 4 wedges with 695MB P. 58-12D bent to 56 for 3 wedge.
  32. Lou G

    Lou G
    San Diego, CA

    54-12D bent to 53, 58-04T, 64W for 4 wedges. 58-12D bent to 56 and 64W for 3 wedges. I carried 58-14K bent to 56 before. I can play D grind off a hard lie but play back. Where D wins out over K is full swings and soft lies. I love the new 58-04T since I can play more open stance shots off tight lies.
  33. Fred G

    Fred G

    Ive just been fitted and same for all 3

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